Attention: Guests by accessing CRO, you agree to the site terms. Please read the terms of CRO Click Here

+-

Sponsor Ads

Author Topic: Racing Paybacks.  (Read 4503 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline CanadianRacingOnline

  • What Should Be Here????
  • Administrator
  • Series Owner
  • *****
  • Posts: 15715
  • 13 Seasons we have been around for.
Racing Paybacks.
« on: September 28, 2011, 12:32:43 PM »
OK this has been a hot topic for over a week on CRO.

This topic is not to point out drivers or who has done this.

I was just wondering how people feel on this topic.

Is Paybacks part of racing? Should it be aloud? When has a payback gone to far? is it OK that other teams get caught up because a driver wanted to do a payback another driver? Should the tracks be more involved and take stronger actions against guys that do paybacks?

These are many questions I have.

I have always thought a payback is like hockey fighting but now that I have revisited this I think it's not the same.

Others get caught up in someone Else's payback and that is not right. I guess the tracks should take paybacks more seriously, as people can get hurt and a lot of times it's not even the party involved in this payback. Tracks need to get drivers off the track if they are telling people they are going to do this before the race even starts. I feel tracks need to penalize drivers for these payback and if they don't it's just going to get worst and before long someone will get really hurt or the police will get involved like they have done in other sport.

Here are some of my thought feel free to comment on this.


Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98074#msg98074
Canadian Racing Archive Project.
http://www.canadianracingarchives.com/

CanadianRacingOnline.com

Racing Paybacks.
« on: September 28, 2011, 12:32:43 PM »

Offline nascar329

  • Series Owner
  • *****
  • Posts: 291
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2011, 02:07:08 PM »
The Incident with BAKER & WALTERS at SUNSET has really been buzzing on CRO and in my opinion it should be over & done with , "let it go"  :o.

I'm sure if SUNSET decides do do anything about it they will, I think Baker should be banned from racing there !

Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98079#msg98079

Offline charger

  • crum-b racings other car
  • Series Owner
  • *****
  • Posts: 591
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2011, 02:20:34 PM »
Rubbin's racing and as long as there is racing there will be payback. I have given and received payback warranted or not, usually if you admit to or have abonehead move admitted  to payback won't happen. But there is as someone else allready said if it's the local weapon who never admits fault or apologizes for a dumb move there is where payback will occur. it's a part of racing fans show up to see hat will happen after last weeks action

Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98080#msg98080
Hold On Not Done Accelerating
winning isn't everything but losing sucks!!!!

CanadianRacingOnline.com

Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2011, 02:20:34 PM »

Offline rocketman

  • Pit Crew
  • **
  • Posts: 16
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2011, 04:03:10 PM »
It depends if you want to win the championship or not........if you start tit for tatting everyone who touches you, and a black is the result, kiss the championship goodbye because points are too valuable...

I'm all for payback, but it usually comes at the expense of a good finish/points, so beware if you want a title, the best payback would be beating them on the track.

if you are out of the points because of a dirty move by someone, and you can pay your repairs, it's open season on them....just be careful you don't take anyone else out or you begin the cycle all over again with a new dance partner.

good management at the track can prevent the need for payback, because the first offender should be penalized such that the victim feels less of a need for payback because the track dealt with it properly in the first place....that rarely happens though

Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98088#msg98088

Offline CanadianRacingOnline

  • What Should Be Here????
  • Administrator
  • Series Owner
  • *****
  • Posts: 15715
  • 13 Seasons we have been around for.
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2011, 04:22:25 PM »
This has nothing too do with them the topic might be in result of this and many years of paybacks I have heard of on here.

I don't want to talk about those two as it has nothing to do with it.



The Incident with BAKER & WALTERS at SUNSET has really been buzzing on CRO and in my opinion it should be over & done with , "let it go"  :o.

I'm sure if SUNSET decides do do anything about it they will, I think Baker should be banned from racing there !

Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98089#msg98089
Canadian Racing Archive Project.
http://www.canadianracingarchives.com/

Offline Gary36

  • Rookie Driver
  • ***
  • Posts: 95
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2011, 11:02:52 PM »
If the track is dilligent and consistent with catching those who cause accidents or spin cars out, and send them to the back, that will usually eliminate the need for someone to want to retaliate.  If the agressor doesn't get sent to the back it can build up with the other team and spill over into the pits, and worse every week after that.

I don't do pay backs.  Here's why.

1) Most times it can be resolved....Whether the track sends the driver to the back or not, I usually give him a chance to come clean and put the issue to rest by talking about it after the race.  I've been dumped many times and in most cases the driver came to me after.  If I retaliate before the race is over, I didn't give him a chance to calm down and make it right by talking about it. If I spin someone I let him know right away I'm sorry.

2) Not good for your fans....if a driver retaliates and the issue spills over in the pits, it can make fans, yours and the other drivers, upset. We don't need that. Let us race hard on the track and our fans can both enjoy a good hard race.

3) It's not good for sponsors...if a driver takes the high road and doesn't retaliate he will make a better impression on sponsors of his own and more than likely the other car.

4) It's too expensive....getting into a feud with one driver can be very costly, with more than one could end your year.

5) It's kills your spirit.....sometimes retaliating can feel good, but most times it starts the beginning of something that will only get worse, and spill off into other teams.  Going to the race track and socializing with your peers before a race is relaxing and fun. I race because it's fun, winning isn't the reason I go to a race track, racing is the reason I go. If I'm preoccupied with a feud or wondering if it;s over, it will take away the fun, it can  kill it for you and your crew.

6) Involves innocent racers....this was mentioned as well and the last thing anyone wants to do is dump a car in retaliation,  and end up taking out someone else.

Winning a championship is the highest achievement we can get in racing. Winning a race is good, winning a feature is awesome, but neither ever compares to being crowned a champion. When 24 cars show up we know only one car can win and tonight, even though we're going to try our best to win, our best finish may be 5th or 8th.  When that happens we come back the next week and try to do better again. by racing as hard as we can without wrecking us or anyone else.

The plus side of racing clean, and not retaliating, even when you could,  is the respect you get from your peers.  That payday can be huge.  
  

Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98105#msg98105
« Last Edit: September 28, 2011, 11:10:18 PM by Gary36 »

Offline Shadowracer

  • .
  • Global Moderator
  • Series Owner
  • *****
  • Posts: 2818
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2011, 01:24:46 AM »
Bottom line: If a track allows things to get out of control, it will.

Officials need to put a stop to rough driving. Guys spout this BS quote from a frigging Tom Cruise movie, when the fact of the matter is, rubbing is NOT NECESSARILY racing. Intentional rubbing is cheating. Guys who engage in the practice as a habit should be sent to the back if it happens once, and parked if it happens twice....and AUTOMATICALLY parked for the night for intentionally damaging someone's car. (and kicked out permanently if it happens again) This business with just getting sent to the back of the line even if you destroyed a guy is bogus.

I hope the track that hosted the "incident that shall not be named" should be paying attention and trying to figure out what they could have done much earlier in the season. You let the inmates police themselves and look what you get. It sucks that a guy got hurt, and I'm sure that part wasn't intentional. But from the sounds of it, the guy had a payback or two coming to him, as the track wouldn't enforce any kind of ruling.

So as far as paybacks being OK or not, I think depends on the commitment level of the officiating to put a curb on rough driving. "Paybacks yes or no?" is too simple an answer to a complicated question.  If the officiating is good then it shouldn't be necessary, and if the officiating sucks, then its unavoidable eventually.

Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98107#msg98107
CHECK OUT THE "SHADOW REPORT" GROUP ON FACEBOOK FOR LIVE RACE PICS AND UPDATES

Offline CanadianRacingOnline

  • What Should Be Here????
  • Administrator
  • Series Owner
  • *****
  • Posts: 15715
  • 13 Seasons we have been around for.
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2011, 08:46:14 AM »
Well said Gary36

A payback is when a drivers intentanally takes another driver out. It has nothing to do with racing for a spot.

Racing for a spot and putting there bumper on someone to let them know you are there and moving them a side is part of racing and I understand this as I have seen many times lapped cars not getting out of the way for the leaders of the race and the lapped car causes the wreak and this shouldn't happen so yes a bump and run is fine.

But we are talking about a driver seeking out another driver to wreak him for a payback that happened maybe last week or a couple of weeks ago.


I like to input on this topic, as you have a drivers view and the fans view on this. Now all we need is a tracks view on it and we have all possible perspectives on this.



Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98111#msg98111
Canadian Racing Archive Project.
http://www.canadianracingarchives.com/

Offline Racer43

  • Series Owner
  • *****
  • Posts: 471
    • Facebook Page
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2011, 09:29:11 AM »
Alot of times its a judgement call that needs to be made. The guys driving the cars are just as human as the guys making the calls and never will the actions or the calls be perfect. We all make mistakes that just the way it is. The bottom line is there are all kinds of people out there. The guy that feels its neccesary to retaliate is likely the same type that chases you down the highway for miles because you accidently cut him off as he was trying to overtake the miles of transports holding up traffic. Road rage is simalair to racing retaliation. The differences in the way people handle things is what makes this world an interesting place to be. Do I agree with going out there with the mind set "Im going to get him?" No I dont but its going to happen its just the way it is. My attitude has always been, if you go apologize for something that happened and talk it out like gentlemen then it should be done. We all make mistakes, but the true test of ones class is how they deal with the bumps in the road. I personally would rather pass a guy who has spun us with my hand out the window reminding him he's number one in my mind aswell as his. No better revenge than beating the guy cleanly rather than beating on him repeatedly like the idiot he is. Anyone can go out there and hit everything in sight to gain positions, the real talent is in making clean passes and focusing on the next ones needed to be made in order to get to the front.
A few weeks ago a good friend of mine and I were racing nose to tail in traffic. Coming off the corner he got a bit better of a run than I did and we had some contact sending us around in a cloud of smoke. Was I pissed? Yes, I couldnt believe a buddy had spun us out. Next thing I know we're at the back together. So I pull up beside him with my hand out the window asking WTF was that, he gives me the palms up i dont know sorry look. Done for now, I said to myself we'll talk about it after we make our way back up to the front and hopefully salvage half decent finishes out of the shitty circumstances. Did he mean to spin us.... no.... was he sorry for spinning us..... yes.  Anyway we had a couple pops after the race and talked about it. The racing gods hadnt shined on us tonight and it was unfortunate that we got together, but stuff does happen when your racing around on the edge of control inches apart. Now I cant wait for next year to get the opportunity to pay him back!!! its going to feel great to reel him in and drive by him on the outside with my hand out the window giving him the thank you wave like he had let me by.

Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98114#msg98114
Follow on Twitter @Jay_Doerr
Facebook - Jay Doerr

Offline disturber

  • Rookie Driver
  • ***
  • Posts: 98
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2011, 09:38:29 AM »
intentional or just a dumb decision? how should you react? is it different?

saw a guy spin towards (and on) the infield this year, he tried to save it but ended up coming back onto the track and taking 2other cars out. spoke to him, "he said split second decision, thought i could save it and join back in safely. probably should have just let it spin out and stop on the grass." one other car's driver just shrugged, "sh*t happens*. The other team is livid, comes to the pit for a fight, etc. tries to wreck the guy the next week, that sort of stuff. i talked to that guy too, he said "i know it wasn't intentional, but his bonehead move meant my car still got wrecked cause of him, so he's gonna pay".


Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98115#msg98115

Offline Racer43

  • Series Owner
  • *****
  • Posts: 471
    • Facebook Page
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2011, 10:59:35 AM »
boo hoo.... sounds to me like that guy is in the wrong sport. As Shrader used to say, if you buckle in your 50% responsible for what happens on the track. If you think your going to make it through your racing carreer without getting takin out by some bonehead who makes a mistake. Your sadly mistaken!!

Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98118#msg98118
Follow on Twitter @Jay_Doerr
Facebook - Jay Doerr

Offline Shadowracer

  • .
  • Global Moderator
  • Series Owner
  • *****
  • Posts: 2818
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #11 on: September 29, 2011, 01:55:25 PM »
Go to that extreme and you have a non-contact class where you send anyone to the back who even touches anyone. Makes a good class for rookies to learn, but it is less exciting for the fans. It quickly shuts down a menace that thinks they are Earnhardt, but I wouldnít want to see LM run that way. Mosport 6-or-less ran under those rules, it served its purpose there.

You are going to trade paint threading the needle 3-wide. You are going to tap a bumper trying to force a nose in. There is going to be a time 2 guys try for the same spot of track. Thatís rubbing, and thatís racing. Itís not an excuse for a demo derby like some may use it.

Sometimes the guy who got his equipment destroyed was a car running above their ability, blocking 3 lanes and creating a log jam. When they get moved, and end up hitting the wall rather than collecting it outside the groove could be a reflection of their driving ability, rather than the degree of contact. It wouldnít be fair to park a top running car for wrecking equipment in a situation like that.



True enough, and I think anyone who knows racing at all will understand that there's a line. Racing is a contact sport and everyone knows that. I'm not advocating racing as a non-contact thing. And if you block a guy lap after lap, you should expect that person to figure out a way to move you. Fair is fair, and blocking is not kosher.

So to go back to that inane quote for a second...."rubbin is racin" (say it with a rednecky accent for maximum effect) But spinning a guy on purpose or knocking a guy into a fence on purpose isn't rubbing. Stuff happens, as Racer43 pointed out (and I know eactly the incident he's referring to) , but officials, if they have any sort of clue, can usually tell the difference.



Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98123#msg98123
CHECK OUT THE "SHADOW REPORT" GROUP ON FACEBOOK FOR LIVE RACE PICS AND UPDATES

Offline godsmack

  • Race Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 5
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #12 on: September 29, 2011, 05:56:07 PM »
i have been taken out of a race recently by a lapped car ,should i have wrecked him at the time i wanted to kick his ass but seeing my kids with i thought the better of it ,so after the race and into the next week when he came into the shop and still didnt own up to his mistake should i do it or not thats the question. in the end i did not stuff him or touch him for that fact

Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98129#msg98129

Offline kcbc

  • Team Owner
  • *****
  • Posts: 176
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #13 on: September 29, 2011, 08:22:12 PM »
Quote
I think XXXXXX should be banned from racing there !

 
I don`t think there should be any suspensions or `` bannings``because  that just means there`s one less driver, 2 or more team members, possibly family support that are not at the track which for a track management mean less pit admission, less food revenue. They should be fined heavily

As for payback  I think that it means you have no respect for your equipment, the other persons equipment

If you have been bullied as a kid everyday for 2 years at school and the only way to stop it is to beat the *** out of the bully would you do it?

Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98132#msg98132

Offline tractorfix

  • Rookie Driver
  • ***
  • Posts: 54
Re: Racing Paybacks.
« Reply #14 on: September 29, 2011, 09:09:31 PM »
One time this year I was the BONEHEAD. I made a mistake and took me and another guy bigtime into the wall. As soon as I parked my car I went over to apologize. Sure he was pretty hot but he was a gentleman about it and we got it sorted out. I still feel bad about it. OH well, that's racing. I made a mistake and we both paid.
I have also been hit many times in competition by cars either being driven beyond limits or simply jockeying for position in very close quarters. Most of the time you take it as it comes and carry on. You get kind of a 6th sense of what was intentional and what was not.
BUT SOMETIMES there are guys that try to intimidate others by bashing and crashing and other threatening means. You cannot let these bullies think they have gotten the better of you.
Whether its a fender for a fender or a screaming match in the pits, you gotta go right back at these clowns. You don't have to do anything stupid, you just have to let them know in no uncertain terms that you won't take their crap.

Linkback: /smf/index.php?topic=14370.msg98135#msg98135

 


HTML ezBlock

site
stats
Powered by EzPortal