Author Topic: September 1st Cayuga (Read 6924 times)

DWfan4ever · « **Reply #15 on:** July 08, 2007, 04:38:29 PM »

Well I guess we'll just have to see what happens next season with both series. From a fans perspective I'd say I got more entertainment from both of the NCTS events I've attended this year compared to the 1 OSS event and the comments from others about the OSS race at Sauble. I really hope both series grow but I'm wondering if the same will happen to the OSS as the ALSTAR series?? Both had solid sponsors to the series but the car counts just didn't draw the fans.

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CanadianRacingOnline.com · « **Reply #15 on:** July 08, 2007, 04:38:29 PM »

Pinecrest · « **Reply #16 on:** July 08, 2007, 06:23:36 PM »

Some thoughts on how the OSS could find its own niche market . As has been stated the crate only engine rule if a Dodge Ford Chev equal paying field could be established . If a crate only deal cant happen for what ever reason an ignition rule of 7000 rpm (or what ever) through the use of mandated box be it MSD ,Mallory or who ever that you get at the track and give back after the race. Everyone is going to have to buy an ignition anyway , this way they would just get them from the OSS who if they were buying them 20 or 30 at a time would be getting them cheaper and quite possibly free or almost free the way ARCA has turned the Mallory ignition into a main sponsor of the series.

The OSS needs to promote their drivers , they have the father son thing they could do allot with and the female angle they could milk with Taws . If we have learnt anything from NASCAR is that its the jockey not the horse that draws the people . The old days of the Ford Chev Dodge rivalries are almost gone and you have to get the names of your drivers out there with radio interviews mall appearances etc etc . This is not that easy to do and takes allot of time but not necessarily allot of money.

The trying to put multiple dirt track races on the schedule is something I believe could really put the OSS on the map . ARCA draws some of their biggist crowds of the year when the run their dirt shows and there seems to be a resurgence of interest in dirt track racing . The interest that this could bring to the series is infinite as you could get some dirt teams that would find this a good way to transion to pavement and perhaps vice versa . The one thing the series would have to be careful of is anyone building dirt exclusive cars and this would have to be stopped dead in its tracks .

The OSS can only genrate purses of so much but where they could do a better job then some series past and present is keeping costs down .

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MID · « **Reply #17 on:** July 08, 2007, 08:50:42 PM »

Good points Pinecrest and I agree with all of them.
Keeping the cost down in racing is allot easier then what people think.
Any sereis that runs a rule book and uses 'Stock' parts is where the cost of racing goes up. For instance, the CASCAR now NASCAR ruling on lower A frames should have been thrown out years ago. You can buy a Allstar Adjustable lower for around $80.00 and it is a over the counter part. To find lower A frames, stock, your only source is to purchase them from a wrecking yard which will run you $100.00, then you have to strip it down- 4 hours labour, then you have to put in the ball joints, another $45.00, and then you have to install the monoballs, another $60.00.
The Allstar adjustable Lower complete - $80.00
The GM lower complete- $200 + + +

Quick change rearends are far cheaper to run then the Ford 9".
The price of one Ford 9" Gear set complete is $800.00
The price of say 12 different gear sets for a quick change - $500.00

Theses are all examples and I could go on and on about how and where to save money, but I am sure you get my point.
Hopefully, because the OSS is Club Run, maybey we can all sit down at our year end meeting and make some renovations to the current rule book. If they want me to do it I would in a heart beat as we already have most the numbers and parts that apply to cost saving and better equipment at the same time.

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CanadianRacingOnline.com · « **Reply #17 on:** July 08, 2007, 08:50:42 PM »

Racechaser · « **Reply #18 on:** July 08, 2007, 09:28:46 PM »

Dave:
Everyone already has the 9" rear end gears so why change. There are lots of used gear sets around. The aftermarket lowers is a good plan. The stock ones bought new and modified are $400 - $500 each.

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robblee_motorsports · « **Reply #19 on:** July 08, 2007, 09:59:01 PM »

Just to set the record straight. Dad broke a gear at Sauble.
And as for my stellar performance, lets just say that my executive decision to tighten up the car before the second 50 lapper wasn't exactly a good one. Lesson learned.
Shame about Cayuga, hopefully they can sort it all out.
And as for motors, what about a spec-motor? You can get over the counter parts at a reasonable price for each manufacturer. This would allow guys like McGlynn (for example), who build their own motors, to keep competitive and still do their own work. I don't think messing with the rules and making everybody buy a bunch of stuff is the way to go.
Anyone interested can check out Delaware's spec rule, they have used it an option for a while now.

Matt Robblee
OSS #27

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MID · « **Reply #20 on:** July 09, 2007, 07:40:04 AM »

I did not say we should change our rear ends to quick changes, I was using it as an EXAMPLE on where you can save allot of money.
If I was to start a new series tommorrow, this is one componet that would be in the car for sure.
As for the Spec motor- the only problem here is guys will still cheat up the engines, although the way around that is to put a $2500 engine claim rule into effect for EXAMPLE.

The claimer rule amount of money should be based on what the cost of the spec parts that are inside it, in short if the spec parts add up to $4500.00 then make the engine claim rule $4500.00.

As everyone knows, there are no two engines the same.
You can bolt in the same parts into 2 different blocks and your going to have 2 different sets of records off of the Dyno. As for the Dry Sump engines verse the wet sump engines, again, the HP numbers will always be different.

The Engine we run in our OSS car is a dry sump only because that is what we have in stock. Our Gibbons motors vary from 410 HP and go up from there.
The engine in our OSS car is our smallest HP motor we have in stock and we do relize that it is much smaller on the HP then say McGlynn's or Robblee's Sportsman engine's.
Everyone say's to us- ya but you guys are running a dry sump Super Series motor.
My reply to that.... If McGlyn or Robblee want to swap engines, I have no problem what so ever with that, except we would be putting a Ford engine into our Monte Carlo.
We could do it and call it a Forde Carlo !!

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Hardracing · « **Reply #21 on:** July 09, 2007, 05:31:16 PM »

Quote from: midamerica on July 09, 2007, 07:40:04 AM

I did not say we should change our rear ends to quick changes, I was using it as an EXAMPLE on where you can save allot of money.
If I was to start a new series tommorrow, this is one componet that would be in the car for sure.
As for the Spec motor- the only problem here is guys will still cheat up the engines, although the way around that is to put a $2500 engine claim rule into effect for EXAMPLE.

The claimer rule amount of money should be based on what the cost of the spec parts that are inside it, in short if the spec parts add up to $4500.00 then make the engine claim rule $4500.00.

As everyone knows, there are no two engines the same.
You can bolt in the same parts into 2 different blocks and your going to have 2 different sets of records off of the Dyno. As for the Dry Sump engines verse the wet sump engines, again, the HP numbers will always be different.

The Engine we run in our OSS car is a dry sump only because that is what we have in stock. Our Gibbons motors vary from 410 HP and go up from there.
The engine in our OSS car is our smallest HP motor we have in stock and we do relize that it is much smaller on the HP then say McGlynn's or Robblee's Sportsman engine's.
Everyone say's to us- ya but you guys are running a dry sump Super Series motor.
My reply to that.... If McGlyn or Robblee want to swap engines, I have no problem what so ever with that, except we would be putting a Ford engine into our Monte Carlo.
We could do it and call it a Forde Carlo !!

I think quick changes should be optional though. I think the only performance advantage they give is a better gear selection and obviously faster gear changes. (Maybe someone can correct me if I'm wrong). To run the OSS next year, we would have to buy a lot of gears and for the same money we could buy a rear end and a few gears. We've borrowed them this year just to get to a few tracks.
As far as the engine claim rule is concerned, I'd rather not hear any more about that even if it is just an EXAMPLE, but I get your point. Definitely the crate deal is a good way to go.

Peter Wall
Crew Chief
OSS# 58

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GiddyG · « **Reply #22 on:** July 09, 2007, 05:47:29 PM »

It's cool to see the teams contributing to this post and the message board in general.

Now back to your regularly schedules threads....

GG

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Pinecrest · « **Reply #23 on:** July 09, 2007, 07:55:10 PM »

Quote from: robblee_motorsports on July 08, 2007, 09:59:01 PM

Just to set the record straight. Dad broke a gear at Sauble.

Matt Robblee
OSS #27

I liked racechasers version better where he was paralyzed with fear when he saw Malibu Barbie in the mirror

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hill3 · « **Reply #24 on:** July 09, 2007, 08:34:07 PM »

hi new to your forum. i am the tech director for the SEIMENS WEST tour. if at all possible who is the head tech for the OSS,i would like to talk to them wrt to crate and spec engines. we do have the gm 604in three cars and soon will have a dodge crate. this will be the asa approved crate.we are also on 8"tire,goodyears and the seem to be holding up well how are yours doing. i think a dailogue between east and west would be good thing to help both series,nice web site,it is one of the things we have yet to get up and running. so far i have been pleasedith car count and feel this will grow in time.

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racingwrench · « **Reply #25 on:** July 09, 2007, 10:55:00 PM »

I have been hearing talk around some of the dirt tracks that the bigger DLM teams have found that the quicker gear change and wider range of ratio's is outweighed by the parasitic power losses of the extra parts in a quick change and that they can fine tune the ratio acceptably through tire size. (I am still a fan of the quick change though)

As for reinventing the car in the OSS via a continueous stream of rule changes would be a step backwards considering that the OSS is a group full of teams that could not afford the expense of the nascar series and it's many hoops (rule changes). My main concern is that they need to try not to alienate existing teams with new engine rule.

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racerman · « **Reply #26 on:** July 09, 2007, 11:41:06 PM »

hello everone,in responce to rule changes for the oss.I think things should stay the same as the rule book that we are running under.guick change would be nice but i have gears so go buy the gears you need to run.This series is based on the cascar sportsman rules.There are lots of used cars and gears and parts out there.we have a 20 year old car and proved that we can run up front each week.we won at sauble and this proves that if you work hard and figure out your car you can win with old equipment.no shock changes or other crap,maybe get rid of tonys mufflers and add some sound and excitment to the show.Nascar did so can we.crates sound good that might work.also we won with a sportsman legal moter , other guys have built moters and super series moters.It felt good to run as good as we did with stuff that isnt up to par with other teams.maybe set up and working hard in the garage does pay off .see everyone in peterbough .dont do what delaware has done and make everyone buy new stuff.there is a lot of good used cars and parts out there for a good price.Mike Hryniuk # 80

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MID · « **Reply #27 on:** July 10, 2007, 06:53:25 AM »

I agree with all of you when you say no rule changes, but if there is an opertunity to save the teams money on different parts that are not performance inhancments, then I am all for change.
Lower A frame rule- allow the HOWE or Allstar lower- $85.00 for a GM copy.

Mufflers- chuckem these are supposed to sound like race cars.

Rear ends- if you have Ford gear sets- runem- if you are a Late Model guy and you want to join our sereies, go ahead and run your quick change. If you watch the Toyota Allstar Shootout- they run both and it makes no differance.

Upper Control arms- Use what ever you want on eith side as long as the size is betwen 8" and 9 1/4".... forget about the equal stuff.

As for motor's- this is the biggest fence to climb because you do not want t mandate an engine rule when you are trying to save teams money, on the other hand you want to keep it affordable, so the 'option' of a crate motor needs to be addressed to allow more guys to run in the OSS, and to help save money for the guys already here.

Again, these examples are options, and they are options directed at saving the racers wallet, but still keeping the cars safe, dependable, and not out performing the other teams buy using performance realted parts. To get this series off the ground and to increase its car counts, we may be forced to take a look at other rule books to see what other series runs within range of the OSS rules.
Take a Delaware Late Model for instance- what would we need to do to allow them the chance to come and run with us. Is it as simple as a chip in the MSD box ? Change the shocks to Afco or Monroe? Smaller Carbs? Add more weight !!
I think you now get my point.

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Hardracing · « **Reply #28 on:** July 10, 2007, 06:08:24 PM »

Quote from: midamerica on July 10, 2007, 06:53:25 AM

I agree with all of you when you say no rule changes, but if there is an opportunity to save the teams money on different parts that are not performance enhancements, then I am all for change.
Lower A frame rule- allow the HOWE or Allstar lower- $85.00 for a GM copy.

Mufflers- chuck em these are supposed to sound like race cars.

Rear ends- if you have Ford gear sets- run em- if you are a Late Model guy and you want to join our series, go ahead and run your quick change. If you watch the Toyota Allstar Shootout- they run both and it makes no difference.

Upper Control arms- Use what ever you want on Edith side as long as the size is betwen 8" and 9 1/4".... forget about the equal stuff.

As for motor's- this is the biggest fence to climb because you do not want t mandate an engine rule when you are trying to save teams money, on the other hand you want to keep it affordable, so the 'option' of a crate motor needs to be addressed to allow more guys to run in the OSS, and to help save money for the guys already here.

Again, these examples are options, and they are options directed at saving the racers wallet, but still keeping the cars safe, dependable, and not out performing the other teams buy using performance related parts. To get this series off the ground and to increase its car counts, we may be forced to take a look at other rule books to see what other series runs within range of the OSS rules.
Take a Delaware Late Model for instance- what would we need to do to allow them the chance to come and run with us. Is it as simple as a chip in the MSD box ? Change the shocks to AFC or Monroe? Smaller Cabs? Add more weight !!
I think you now get my point.

Boy, I gotta say I agree alot with what you've said. As far as the Delaware Late Models, night and day difference. I've worked alot with these cars and they are so different in front and rear geometry, I don't think too many teams would be willing to make substantial changes to their cars to run with the old Ca scar cars, but I get what you're saying.

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Racer43 · « **Reply #29 on:** July 10, 2007, 06:49:16 PM »

Midamerica....your on the right track, but good luck convincing the OSS of those ideas. OSS cars are old technology....still good fun to drive but old..... Like Schrader said after the Nascar Cayuga deal " there like cars we used to run with terrible shocks " Dont get me wrong I'd love to run with u guys but it doesn't seem feasable. I was at your Cayuga show talking to the tech guys. If I was to purchase an old sportsman and drop my drivetrain out of my Delaware LM could I come run with you ? I asked. They really didn't give me answer either way.... maybe for no points or money they said ? I do believe this is a club that could be quite successful but like everything nowadays it has to be done right.
By the way good job at Sauble Mike.
How long has it been since your last win ?
Jay

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