Author Topic: Changes to Stock 4 (Read 7097 times)

warmachine · « **on:** October 17, 2011, 08:24:48 PM »

An open discussion for any drivers/team members and fans from the stock 4 division looking for things that worked or didn't work for your division this year and what changes you would like to see to improve the division next season?

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98589#msg98589

CanadianRacingOnline.com · « **on:** October 17, 2011, 08:24:48 PM »

ministock19 · « **Reply #1 on:** October 17, 2011, 10:19:50 PM »

Varney (and flamboro) need to join the 20th century and allow 16v cars.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98606#msg98606

blackmagic · « **Reply #2 on:** October 17, 2011, 10:52:05 PM »

Quote from: ministock19 on October 17, 2011, 10:19:50 PM

Varney (and flamboro) need to join the 20th century and allow 16v cars.

ummmm...welcome to the 21st century
have you noticed what has happened to the other tracks because they NEEDED 16 valve cars?Peterborough is the best example

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98607#msg98607

CanadianRacingOnline.com · « **Reply #2 on:** October 17, 2011, 10:52:05 PM »

warmachine · « **Reply #3 on:** October 17, 2011, 10:57:38 PM »

16v is part of the debate for sure. but for the last two tracks making a mustang a option there car counts where very close to the tracks alllowing 16v.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98608#msg98608

ministock19 · « **Reply #4 on:** October 17, 2011, 11:21:32 PM »

Varney (and flamboro) need to allow 16v. They dont neccessarily have to let them race against the stock 4/ministocks. But to ignore and dismiss 16v cars is foolish and short sighted.They will be a major part in the future of racing,better to embrace them now than fall further behind.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98611#msg98611

ministock19 · « **Reply #5 on:** October 18, 2011, 08:16:27 AM »

Car selection/engine selection can be limited by implementing the proper rules. Example: only allow chev models from year 2000-2005, Neons from 1997-2005, whatever ford product is on par with them.,etc.
Outlaw vtech/vvvt and other goodies right from the start.Make them all weigh 2500 lbs minimum, put em on a spec tire and have at it. Proper tech with proper handicaps and a standalone 16v class would be viable.

Or how about a spec tube chassis, running a 16v rear wheel drive setup with an outlaw style body.Just need a builder, how about you there Yetti??

This topic is way too deep and involved to be hashed around on a message board.Methinks we need about a 3 day summit meeting of interested parties to figure a solution.How about a 3 day meeting in florida during speedweeks??

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98625#msg98625

blackmagic · « **Reply #6 on:** October 18, 2011, 12:19:14 PM »

I see someone has seen or experienced exactly what I am talking about

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98635#msg98635

warmachine · « **Reply #7 on:** October 18, 2011, 04:43:16 PM »

All good info, but lets not let this topic dies with just convo about 16v? I was hoping to hear about taching, handicapping, winning car types, even fields, uneven fields, sponsors, purses etc if I could.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98659#msg98659

AaronM 29 · « **Reply #8 on:** October 18, 2011, 05:14:00 PM »

they should worry about the low car count classes first lol

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98662#msg98662

charlie7 · « **Reply #9 on:** October 18, 2011, 08:53:42 PM »

Leave the 4 cyl classes alone everywhere, thats what will help. No rule changes. Ya Varney needs to let in the 16 valves.

16 valves arent the problem, its the morons spending 4-5 grand on old crappy pushrod mustang motors to try and keep up with something that makes 120 hp stock, and only costs 300 bucks at the wreckers. Its your won fault if you choose not to run a wrecking yard motor for 500 bucks and pushes out big power.

The 80s just called, they want their cast iron everything back. Ill stick with plastic and aluminum and easy to find thanks.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98673#msg98673

varneyspeedway · « **Reply #10 on:** October 21, 2011, 04:33:50 PM »

Quote from: ministock19 on October 17, 2011, 11:21:32 PM

Varney (and flamboro) need to allow 16v. They dont neccessarily have to let them race against the stock 4/ministocks. But to ignore and dismiss 16v cars is foolish and short sighted.They will be a major part in the future of racing,better to embrace them now than fall further behind.

The last thing Varney needs is to create ANOTHER division. We already have 6 that we try desparately to fill the fields in. I dont believe 16v is the only answer in this debate.As more tracks allow them, this creates an opportunity for Varney and Flamboro. While our counts are down, flamboro doesnt seem too worried as they started 24 minis in the feature the last time I was there and, they even ran a consi. They probably had 30 mini stocks show up that night. Not too bad for a track that needs to get into the modern era according to this thread. Varney consistently sees about 20 minis show up on a regular race night.

you want to increase car counts, fix the bloody economy. dont find yet another class to ruin by over pricing the crap out of it.

suggesting Varney run 16 valves is hypocrisy. We ran two invitationals this past summer for 16v cars to come and test the waters and all of three cars showed up. If you expect us to conform for three dudes....think again.

Varneys low car counts are not due to drivers jumping to other tracks. In fact, if you went through the registered drivers list at the other area tracks, you will find that varney has lost maybe 6 or 7 cars to other tracks. We have also gained 6 or 7 cars from other tracks. The drivers you used to see at Varney 5 years ago that you dont now, cant afford it. Bottom line. Fix the economy, you will see car counts increase.

Crying for varney to allow 16valve just sounds like sour grapes to me. Ive also found that the guys making the most noise about varney allowing 16valve cars have no intention of coming and running at varney anyway so, whats the point.

just another thing to get online and whine about.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98722#msg98722

ministock19 · « **Reply #11 on:** October 21, 2011, 10:39:54 PM »

Ok, so thunders are completely dead at Varney, street stocks have consistently shrunk for years, late models and mods are stagnant. Why not allow 16v and let them run with street stocks, the lap times/race pace should be very close. Maybe in a couple of years if the 16v count grows then they can turn into a viable class.

quote:
We ran two invitationals this past summer for 16v cars to come and test the waters and all of three cars showed up. :quote
The 16v neon that was from Barrie ran very competetive with the top cars at Varney. So why not allow neons,maybe 2 or 3 will show up and increase the car count? How is that a bad thing?

If there is a fear of 16v coming in and dominating, then specify exactly what makes/models are allowed, post the specs that they have to conform to right in the rules package.
What i really dont understand is why are people so unwilling to try to do something outside the box to try to boost car counts?
The status quo is not working and has not been working for many years.You cannot control the economy so you better look at other areas that you can control.

Btw, I currently field two 12v ministocks,allowing 16v would actually be a bad thing for my personal racing program. However if it will help the long term future of short track racing then I am all for it,even if it means my stuff becomes obsolete.

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ministock19 · « **Reply #12 on:** October 21, 2011, 11:00:28 PM »

Starting up the Enduro this year was, I think, a very good first step.I hope they are back in 2012 and beyond. But it also creates a small problem involving 16v cars.
16v are allowed in the enduro. So if someone runs an enduro car but decides they want to move up a class but wants to run the same type of car, what do they do? Buy all new stuff ? Too expensive. Get an old Monte and build a street stock? Cant find old Monte`s. Buy a thunder? Not running at Varney.
See where I am going here?

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charlie7 · « **Reply #13 on:** October 22, 2011, 02:38:15 PM »

Allowing the 16v 4cyls to run with the street stock would make a better race with more cars yes for sure, a great idea that way. Only issue:

Safety.

I was running the special on night in September, and in practice I didnt feel so hot about being beside 3,300lb full frame street stocks while I was in a smaller unibody car that was at least 900lbs to its junior. Some of those street stocks noses have a big ass bumper that is in line with the top of the hood on some neons LOL.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14436.msg98734#msg98734

ministock19 · « **Reply #14 on:** October 22, 2011, 03:19:02 PM »

The street stocks started the year weighing 3100 lbs.Mid year they switched to the hoosier tire and added 200 lbs.They could easily be scaled back to 3000-3100 lbs. When I suggested 16v running with street stocks, I should specify twin cam 16v, weigh them at 2600-2700 lbs,putting both types of cars in the ballpark weightwise, race pace of both types of cars should be very close. Heck, while on this subject, what about including v-6 in the debate?
Just spitballin an idea here, I am sure there are many pros and cons to it.Might be one way to get more cars out.

Last point, bumper heights can be altered or standardized relatively easy.I have had the same safety concerns over the years but If the weights can be made close that is a more pressing concern. As it is now we have some minis near 2700 lbs and others around 2200 lbs.

BTW for all the 16v haters, do you not realize that 99.9% of all street stocks/thunders/LLM/LM/SLM are 16v cars?

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