Jimmy Jonhson wins championship again who cares

[CanadianRacingOnline]

I have been see this title all over the net. I tend to agree as under the old champion standards. Gordon Wins 2 more Championships, Stewart has another one, Carl Edwards has one and so on.

Is it just me or has nascar become boring. I seem not to care as much about missing a race as in years past. I have never liked the new format. If you want to have a playoff you remove the other 31 competitors and let the 12 battle it out.

This year I have even opted not to renew my tickets to Michigan speedway after going for over 10 years. I could really care less about the big name stars anymore as they have been turned into robots it seems.

I liked the days when a driver could show his frustration to other drivers or say something was wrong without the fear of fines but now you have to watch everything you say as someone might hear your on a scanner.

The most exciting race this year was when Gordon and Burton had a cat fight other wise I can't really remember the rest.

My suggestion is go to your local tracks where the drivers have emotions and not robotic battery pack with the right way to act.

Support the local tracks as they seem to be putting on a better show then Robotcar is putting on these days.

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[polishprince12]

+100 evan!

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[Shadowracer]

Well, there's lots of reasons NASCAR might be losing its appeal to a lot of people, but I don't think the Chase, or Jimmie Johnson, are the reasons for it.

Personally, I think the season is too long, and the Chase itself is great, but about twice as long as it should be IMO.

In addition, too much press given to points, not enough on the outcomes of the races themselves, and the era of darn near 24-7 NASCAR coverage are part of the problem. Too much of a good thing can kill it.

Hell, you could debate NASCAR's problems till the cows come home.

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[ernie]

This is interesting.

http://jayski.com/teams/chase2010.htm#75-03



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[Thayne]

I have been see this title all over the net. I tend to agree as under the old champion standards. Gordon Wins 2 more Championships, Stewart has another one, Carl Edwards has one and so on.

Is it just me or has nascar become boring. I seem not to care as much about missing a race as in years past. I have never liked the new format. If you want to have a playoff you remove the other 31 competitors and let the 12 battle it out.

--noone wants to see 12 cars race....wtf?--

This year I have even opted not to renew my tickets to Michigan speedway after going for over 10 years. I could really care less about the big name stars anymore as they have been turned into robots it seems.

you don't listen to Tony's radio show? Or the verbal sparring the past few weeks between Denny and Jimmy? Its been really cool!

I liked the days when a driver could show his frustration to other drivers or say something was wrong without the fear of fines but now you have to watch everything you say as someone might hear your on a scanner.

--Harvick spinning kyle then saying he did didn't do it? Or Carl destroying Keselowski and saying he wasn't gonna let him win. Listen to Montoya or Junior's scanner....

The most exciting race this year was when Gordon and Burton had a cat fight other wise I can't really remember the rest.

--that wasn't exciting? See the championship bounce back and forth all race?

My suggestion is go to your local tracks where the drivers have emotions and not robotic battery pack with the right way to act.

I agree, come out and watch us race!

Support the local tracks as they seem to be putting on a better show then Robotcar is putting on these days.

I don't like these blanket statements....people can say  what they wish....but guys 30 years agoi guys were winning by laps....now its tenths of seconds...I can't wait for Daytona!

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[choirguy]

Yea Thayne And Woo Who Jimmy You Daa Man and Don't be Haters LoL

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[CanadianRacingOnline]

Don't have a problem with how long the season at all. I have a problem when you want guys to just drive in circles and act like robots and that's what it seems like these days. Guys can't express themself and show emotions in the heat of the moment.

Then you take 12 out of 43 and say there is a race in a race. The chase is garbage and If I was a sponsor of the other teams  that don't make the chase I would pull my sponsorship off the cars once the chase begins as it's all about them 12 chase drivers. The other 31 cars once the chase starts should do start and park and let the 12 chase cars go at it.

Wouldn't that be cool? The chase drivers racing 200 laps by themself on the track. That would be something I would watch. To make it intresting you get extra points for leading at different points of the race and you don't know when it is but they tell you at the end of the race.

NASCAR has a hall of fame and all but what pisses me off is they refer to drivers from the past era's sprint cup champions. Sorry they were Winston Cup champions. What is wrong with saying winston cup champion when you talk about Richard Petty? He wasn't even driving when Sprint became a sponsor so how in the hell is he a sprint cup champion? Explain this to me as I don't get it one bit.

So all CASCAR champions should be call Nascar Canadian Tire Series Champions when they talk about past champions in CASCAR?

I will be saving my money and going to local track events.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=12670.msg90074#msg90074

[CanadianRacingOnline]

This stat shows how one driver has benefited from the chase.

Year Classic Points Champ
2004 Jeff Gordon (5) Kurt Busch (2)
2005 Tony Stewart (2) Tony Stewart
2006 Jimmie Johnson Jimmie Johnson (2)
2007 Jeff Gordon (6) Jimmie Johnson (3)
2008 Carl Edwards Jimmie Johnson (4)
2009 Jimmie Johnson (2) Jimmie Johnson (5)
2010 Kevin Harvick Jimmie Johnson(6)

They should call this the Jimmy Points system.


Don't get me wrong I'm not a Jimmy Hater. I would be saying the same thing if it was Jeff Gordon or any other driver.

This is sport is based on 43 cars not 12. I hate how the other 31 cars are nothing once the chase starts. one year this is going to happen non chase drivers are going to target chase drivers and take them out.

If this is such a great points system why hasn't any other auto racing taking it on?


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[Wesley_Motorsports]

Evan,

I think your mixing two components up with respects to Sprint Cup points system and how it compares to other sanctioning points system formats. First off, Sprint Cup's racing point system is a sound one. It rewards 1 through 43 a set amount of points for each car's finishing position. Then awards bonus points for most laps lead and leading a lap. With the exception of the bonus point add-ons, F-1, ARCA, ASA and others award points per race in a similar fashion.

The second component is the play-off format, which has been a bone of contention for many. It has finally brought a decent championship fight this year, and only this year. Within the play-off format, the other teams are still fighting for points, in particular the Top 35, which are awarded qualifying spots for the first 5 races next season.

No longer are teams simply giving up in the second half of the season if the points leader was "x" amount of points ahead.

As to your other insight with respects to "robots" on the track, there are signs that the emotion within the sport is coming back,  "let em at it", NASCAR's current policy in self policing is beginning to show interest by fans.

There are several challenges before NASCAR; the jellybean shape of the cars, which all look the same and length of the races. The Nationwide series has brought the new Mustang and Challenger to the series, but GM has resisted (flat out NO) implementing the Camaro body. Fans have reacted favorably the new body styles. There has been pressure to shorten the races which NASCAR has resisted.

Several changes are coming, but some later than others. Will these changes make a difference, I'm not so sure.
Fuel injection is coming which only complicates things, but not until 2012 or possibly 2013. What is coming is Gasoline - Ethanol fuel (5% or 10%) which will require more pit stops, something that NASCAR wants, hopefully under green flag racing conditions. A potential by-product is increased engine durability, possibly whereby the engine is capable of running two races prior to rebuilding, saving teams a pile of money.

Even with these changes, the single most important 'fix' that NASCAR needs is continued economic recovery, which will allow further changes and competition to increase. Current business conditions suggest that it's questionable if sponsors and fans will pack the stands in 2011.

One of the good things that NASCAR has done is listen to the race teams on how to improve the product. A decade ago that would have been impossible. Not everyone is happy with how NASCAR runs its races, but the general consensus is they like how NASCAR runs. When compared to Indy or F-1, it's no contest. Even the SCCA is brutal compared to NASCAR, likely a key reason its no longer the association it once was.

Jimmie Johnson won the championship fair and square this year. Both Hamlin and Harvick had opportunities to win it all at Homestead and both fell short. Even under the "old points system", had all three teams been separated by the same amount of points prior to the race starting and the teams finished where they did at the end of the race, Jimmy Johnson would have still won by the exact same amount of points, because the amount of points awarded has not changed since the 1990's.


Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=12670.msg90077#msg90077

[CanadianRacingOnline]

This is where you are wrong look at the way the points system is and was and Jimmie didn't win 5 in a row. Kevin Harvick would have won the championship.

A sound way of points untill the chase races were they break it in to two races in one. it would be like another sport saying here is our new playoff format.

Baseball example: 1st, 2nd & 3rd place teams battle for win on the same field at the same time. Oh what the hell lets ad another 10 teams play on the field as well on the same day and time.

Do the guys out side of the chase get 10 extra points for each win awarded to them when the chase starts? No why not if the points are awarded the same?

Year Classic Points        Champ
2004 Jeff Gordon (5)      Kurt Busch (2)
2005 Tony Stewart (2)   Tony Stewart
2006 Jimmie Johnson      Jimmie Johnson (2)
2007 Jeff Gordon (6)      Jimmie Johnson (3)
2008 Carl Edwards         Jimmie Johnson (4)
2009 Jimmie Johnson (2) Jimmie Johnson (5)
2010 Kevin Harvick         Jimmie Johnson(6)

Jimmie Johnson won the championship fair and square this year. Both Hamlin and Harvick had opportunities to win it all at Homestead and both fell short. Even under the "old points system", had all three teams been separated by the same amount of points prior to the race starting and the teams finished where they did at the end of the race, Jimmy Johnson would have still won by the exact same amount of points, because the amount of points awarded has not changed since the 1990's.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=12670.msg90079#msg90079

[Racer43]

Winston Cup, Nextel Cup, Sprint Cup, chase, no chase, old points system, new one, doesnt really matter all teams played by the same rules and that 48 team has kicked some serious butt lately. Im not a fan of Jimmie but I sure do respect Chad and what that team has done. Like it or not we have witnessed a piece of racing history here and I say good for them!!!
How many days till Daytona?

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[DWfan4ever]

Well I apparently missed alot this year in the races I saw.  I wished I had been able to watch more of the races all season long especially during the chase due to the action on the track.  You mention the non chasers were lost in all the hype of the chase, umm I heard plenty about Jamie Mcmurray and his solid runs even during the chase.  You had the consistent finishes of the RPM teams despite them not heading to the track with their vehicles until the last minute just cause the cheques had to clear the account first.  I guess I was watching another race at Martinsville while sitting in the stands cause I believe we had Burton beating on Harvick, you had Busch and Gordon tangling and a very entertaining commentary from Kyle Busch on what he thought of what Johnson was doing in front of him.  I wish I had the money to travel to more events all based on the action on the track during the races in the chase.  Am I happy Johnson won not really cause my fav driver didn't win.  But that's how it went again this year and hopefully with the shake up at Hendricks today Jeff will be running for his 5th title next year.  

I agree we will be hearing about a number of changes in NASCAR in general next year whether that be the chase format, length of races.  I just wish we here in Canada didn't have to search all across the tv channels to watch it cause you didn't know which week TSN or TSN2 was gonna have a race.  Already as reported on twitter tonight Michigan is removing 3 sections of grandstands reducing capicty by like 12,000 seats.  So unfortunately that sucks cause a number of tracks have done plenty to attract the fans back and try and make it more affordable for families to attend events.  And now seats are coming down.  Hopefully those fans can still go cause now that you have their interest the worst thing to have happen is lack of seating for them to go watch live.  Something I wish the Canadian tracks would do when it comes to the NASCAR Canadian Tire events is make it more affordable it just might bring more fans out so they keep growing the series.  It's still cheaper to go to an event in the US based on time at the track and cost compared to here in Canada.  I will definitely continue to support my local tracks as best I can cause its where it all starts but I will also be trying to get to more races to see NASCAR in the US it is just that exciting.

Totally my opinion of course.  And yes I miss the racing season already.lol

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[thecrowdpleaser]

I have not been a fan of the chase since its inception. It's manufactured excitement. MANUFACTURED EXCITEMENT meant to satisfy the ratings machine. Something the chase is failing at by the way. While i admit I'll watch, that's more to do with being a fan of racing in general than a fan of the chase itself. Petty won 7, Dale won 7 on the old points system which i believe was a much better test as to who the real champ of an entire race season is/was. As it was previously noted, if the old points system would have been around, Jeff Gordon would have six championships, while Jimmie would have 2, and Harvick would have been this years champ. The conversation would be a completely different one. We would now be talking about Gordons drive to join the seven time champ club. This fact can't be overlooked or underplayed. The fact that NASCAR has implented a circus to crown its champ, only shows the desperation of NASCAR to compete with the NFL in the fall months of the race season.
Is what the 48 crew have been able to do impressive? Of course it is. But what exactly have the won? They've won the chase 5 times. Not 5 championships, they have 2 Chamipionships, in my eyes anyway. Tony would have 2. Equally as impressive. It's why great teams and drivers find it so hard to win, it takes an entire year to be a champ. Something the 48 crew has done twice.

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[Shadowracer]

It could be argued that the post-season in any sport is "manufactured" excitement. NASCAR was just late to get in on it.

Of course, you could just hand the Stanley Cup/World Series/SuperBowl over to the team with the most points over the regular season....but that wouldn't be any fun.

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[Wesley_Motorsports]

Well okay ......... let's split the issue up. I was commenting on the point system and why and how it works as it relates to points awarded. Then comes the issue of the Chase. At the start of the Chase, points then are reset to 5,000 for the top qualifying teams. Points during those 12 races are still awarded based on the classic "Point" system, plus bonus points. What's lacking in any debate surrounding this equation, is how teams race during Chase events. One example is if a team knows where you're going to finish compared to the other Chase teams, your race strategy and tactics and risk taking decisions change. Hamlin's run at Phoenix is the perfect example. They had to pit, while Johnson and Harvick had nothing to lose, based on who was where in the Chase points standings.

If the Chase format wasn't in place, it likely would have changed how each team's decision were determined throughout the event, let alone the rest of Chase races. In my opinion, any analysis or comparison of old and new points system, the results would be flawed because tactics and strategy options can not be taken into account.

This is where the rub is, the Chase - Play-off format. It has its detractors and followers to be sure. I wasn't suggesting I like it or hate it, but it is what it is. And as Kelly has pointed out, even prior to the change in format, there have been dominant teams before it was implemented. There's always going to be controversy and nobody is ever gonna be satisfied to be sure.

NASCAR's argument for the Chase format; competing (entertainment dollars) professional league sports have a play-off format's, so why not use a similar system in racing. I'm still on the fence about the whole issue.

One thing that is very true, NASCAR has in fact, manufactured fan / media excitement by following this format;

a) Bonus points for winning races - which helps determine seeding of the top 12; rewarding those that pushed to win throughout the first half of the season. There were a lot of complaints under the old system that top teams simply needed to finish in the top 5 throughout the season, thus potentially win the championship without actually winning a single event. It nearly happened several times throughout the late 70's and 80's. Hence the bonus point awards. If it's one thing that terrified the France family, it was a winless champion team scenario. At Homestead, both Harvick and Hamlin knew they had get to the front and lead at least one lap to gain / maintain point parity with Johnson as soon as the 48 lead a lap. Is that manufactured excitement? In my opinion yes. Is it gimmicky or fair *shrug*...... When Harvick was hit with a speeding on Pit Road penalty and had to go to the back, it was exciting to see how well his crew beat every other team on pit road. Manufactured or not, that was fun to watch. No different than overtime hockey that changes up the rule to 4 on 4.

b) Considers the mix of race tracks used in the Chase to be balanced (arguable), except the lack of a Road Course; This part has a lot of people up in arms and yelling conspiracy no matter who your favorite team is. Some teams run better at short tracks, than the intermediate or superspeedways. NASCAR believes the most important aspect in picking the 12 venues used for the Chase races - ticket sales.

c) Expanding the original format from 10 qualifiers to 12, possibly expanding it in the future; this continues to get NASCAR in trouble and there's never going to be a right answer for the Chase format. It's exhibit A to Kelly's point of satisfying ratings and sponsor demands. Balance the cost of racing at today's demanding levels requiring millions of dollars to run a Sprint Cup car, I wonder if it has left zero room for any other option to exist.

In my opinion the drawbacks to the Chase, are:

a) No opportunity for a "comeback" for those teams that narrowly lose out qualifying for the Chase (McMurray comes to mind). Imagine a team getting onto a 7 race winning streak over the last 12 races, that generates more excitement in my opinion than the current Chase format.

b) Hendrick, Roush, RCR teams have superior number advantage over other teams in making the Chase, further dividing the have's and have-not teams. Even without the Chase format, this continues to be a concern for me. I think the maximum amount of race teams each "organisation" should be allowed is three on a full time basis and allowed to run a fourth team for a development driver that runs in the Nationwide series, up to a maximum of 4 events.

Manufactured or not, NASCAR has stiff competition for dollars and as I said before, I have to give them credit for trying various concepts. It sure beats being stale and not changing with the times, though I still think they should eliminate the template body style and chassis rules. Funny how I give kudos to NASCAR for trying new things, yet I'm an old school guy; deep down, I still prefer the old system.





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