CanadianRacingOnline.com
Canadian Oval / Road Racing => Canadian Tracks => Sunset Speedway => Topic started by: Thunder6 on September 15, 2009, 11:55:49 PM
-
Okay so I'm going to throw this out there because it's been bugging me here for a few days, I'm not all that bright and I'm sure I missed something, so I invite someone to tell me what it is that I missed.
Sept 6 Thunder Car race, Darryl St. Onge has the race in the bag, gets spun by a car about to go a lap down, gets sent to the back as an involved car...
Sept 13 Ministock race Sunset Speedway points leader Doug Butler is an involved car, does not get sent to the back, and I hear the flagman telling him to take his spot back.
It really seems to me that "rules are not rules" if you're the home track points leader and fan favorite...
Not trying to make problems for people leading the points or anything but it seems the application of "the rules" is spotty at best. I understand what's done is done, but I have a very bad taste in my mouth over this whole deal. Anyone see where I'm coming from here?
-
Kevin as Spencer stated that Rob was the one who ruled and spencer also commented that usually involved cars are sent to the back. Maybe Rob thought that Doug ended up in the grass AVOIDING stieler. jmo
-
avoiding or not, it should be the same across the board...Tex has a legitimate argument here. I always said I dont care if the umpires strike zone is 2 inches of 3 feet, as long as it dsnt move, seems like consistency is all that is being asked here.
Ya,I played a lot of baseball back in the day, what's it to yah?
-
Okay so I'm going to throw this out there because it's been bugging me here for a few days, I'm not all that bright and I'm sure I missed something, so I invite someone to tell me what it is that I missed.
Sept 6 Thunder Car race, Darryl St. Onge has the race in the bag, gets spun by a car about to go a lap down, gets sent to the back as an involved car...
Sept 13 Ministock race Sunset Speedway points leader Doug Butler is an involved car, does not get sent to the back, and I hear the flagman telling him to take his spot back.
It really seems to me that "rules are not rules" if you're the home track points leader and fan favorite...
Not trying to make problems for people leading the points or anything but it seems the application of "the rules" is spotty at best. I understand what's done is done, but I have a very bad taste in my mouth over this whole deal. Anyone see where I'm coming from here?
Kevin,
The way I understand the involved car rule is it depends on if any actual contact is made, then you're classed as an involved car. If you spin to avoid a wreck and make no contact, you are not an involved car and you generally get your spot back.
-
>:( >:( >:( >:( Ya See'' God Dam it'I'm Not the only person with eye balls,,So St.Onge gets screwed,,The way I see it Mark or Steve better have a chat with That Flagger''To Save a lot Of Arguements,Sunset should have Close circut Video around the track along with Transponder System,,Goes to show how much the fans do watch the races,and Kevin ''Your Right again.. >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(
-
St. Onge spun, and stayed sittin there due to traffic and brought out a caution. Butler kept driving right through, yes he hit the spun car trying to avoid it, but in my eyes that is not involved. If thats involved, then half the field should go to the back everytime there is a spin out as everyone checks up and bumps eachother.
-
I agree with thunder 6, Butler was involved, also i think if you stop you are an involved car,when they stick with the rules and realise that Racing is not fair and never will be, they will take a lot of the arguing and b/s out of racing. All Involved cars to the back.
-
>:( >:( >:( >:( Ya See'' God Dam it'I'm Not the only person with eye balls,,So St.Onge gets screwed,,The way I see it Mark or Steve better have a chat with That Flagger''To Save a lot Of Arguements,Sunset should have Close circut Video around the track along with Transponder System,,Goes to show how much the fans do watch the races,and Kevin ''Your Right again.. >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(
only two nights left with the "flagger" or "iron chest". I heard a certain someone is not getting the "invitation" to come back next year. I can neither confirm or deny if they are true tho.
-
From what I understand about this involved to the back rule it just doesn't seem right to me. Why not an instigator rule? Is the tower afraid to make a call? Do they think everyone that gets spun by somebody from behind is brake checking ???
-
Okay so I'm going to throw this out there because it's been bugging me here for a few days, I'm not all that bright and I'm sure I missed something, so I invite someone to tell me what it is that I missed.
Sept 6 Thunder Car race, Darryl St. Onge has the race in the bag, gets spun by a car about to go a lap down, gets sent to the back as an involved car...
Sept 13 Ministock race Sunset Speedway points leader Doug Butler is an involved car, does not get sent to the back, and I hear the flagman telling him to take his spot back.
It really seems to me that "rules are not rules" if you're the home track points leader and fan favorite...
Not trying to make problems for people leading the points or anything but it seems the application of "the rules" is spotty at best. I understand what's done is done, but I have a very bad taste in my mouth over this whole deal. Anyone see where I'm coming from here?
Kevin,
The way I understand the involved car rule is it depends on if any actual contact is made, then you're classed as an involved car. If you spin to avoid a wreck and make no contact, you are not an involved car and you generally get your spot back.
1+ That's how I saw the ruling myself.
-
I saw two cars sideways on the track, one was the lapped car the other St.Onge, both sideways with one hooked on the other. Then St.Onge backed up into 57 Steve Lang and wrecked again. So if thats not INVOLVED i dont know what is?
Yes It sucks for Darryl, but it also sucks for the lapped car. The guy going a lap down is racing too, its not his job to roll over, its the faster car who has to use some caution in traffic.
But if you side-swipe another car that IS going to cause the caution, and you dont stop, spin, or drag body parts, your NOT involved.
But as for lapped cars, I was one of them in that race, and I just plain moved outa the way for the leaders, couse im smarts enough to know when im beat!!
-
Okay so my point was never that St Onge WASN'T an involved car... I get it that he was. My point was he was the LEADER, and he was taken out by a car about to go a lap down. Fact of the matter is the #00 and the #10 mini ended up going backwards in exactly the same place on the track. After contact with someone else. In the case of the #10, what I saw was he tried to drive through spun cars, and in the case of the #00 , he was spun by 21x who then tried to drive through him. I'm one of the guys who was pulling the body out on BOTH sides...
My point here was if you're going to put involved cars to the back, then do it consistently, and if a guy tries to drive through a wreck he should go on the trailer. Or let's look at it this way, the leader should never go to the back 98% of the time. And you could make a case for the guy who is leading and some guy doesn't give me enough room when I come by to lap him, he's getting bounced.
The rule as applied is stupid and needs to be evaluated before next year. And if certain officials are not being impartial then they should kick stones...
And Ashley I know which side I'm on and so does everyone else. As I recall you ran down to get a picture with the #10 after his win... And I recall you telling me "rules is rules" after Darryl got burned Sept 6... Other people saw the #10 have contact so I'm not blind, but it's pretty clear to me what's happening here. A lot of favoritism...
-
Problem is racers only see what they want to see even if its their drivers fault so when u say put the leader back to the front after a spin, the other side say "he chopped down " he brake checked me " blah blah so hey all involved cars to the back and as Thunder say's before the season starts you classify what involved means, if three cars are side ways in front of you and you have no choice but you stop and you touch one slightly technically are you involved ? I say yes.
-
Hey I'm all for close racing and all... But I'm all about fairness too.
Just calling it as I see it, for what it's worth.
If everybody's going to the back then fine, some nights you might not end up where you should be, and some other nights you might end up where you don't deserve.
And if you pile it into some other guy because you want to keep your spot you should be waiting for your buddies at Tim Hortons...
-
Well,this is one of the first times,i have to admit i agree with THUNDER,thou he still is a punk...lol
The flagman,"ironchest"is all over the map,maybe too much shell shock,or army hazing...time for him to say good bye,sooo long,good byeeeeeeeee. ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
Bottom line is Flagman has final ruling. Everyone knows the rule I dont think that is in question here. Was it right Only Doug knows what he did or didnt do out there. Was he lucky ya if there was contact. However How many times in llm has the leader been spun intentional or not and sent to the back? and how many times has a car spun out on its own and the cars avoiding or trying to kept theirs? The call was made Move on!
-
Well,this is one of the first times,i have to admit i agree with THUNDER,thou he still is a punk...lol
The flagman,"ironchest"is all over the map,maybe too much shell shock,or army hazing...time for him to say good bye,sooo long,good byeeeeeeeee. ;D ;D ;D ;D
Aww Larry I can feel the good vibes coming off this post LOL ;D
-
I didn't see the incident with the 10 car, so I won't comment on it.
Keep in mind one thing...if the starter did not see the incident, he relies on the other flagmen/officials to let them know what they saw. It may not have even been the starters own call. It could have been a corner flagman who saw it and called it as they saw it.
Now I know I'm staff and probably will get the usual about how we are all showing favourtism, but I'm just saying that many times the calls are made by others and the starter trusts what was seen by the other flagmen.
-
Well as far as I'm concerned let's leave it at that.
Some people agree and some don't and everybody has their own reasons and sometimes agendas to protect.
Well I'm bigger than that and have more important things to think about anyhow, like upcoming celebrations etc...
-
And Ashley I know which side I'm on and so does everyone else. As I recall you ran down to get a picture with the #10 after his win... And I recall you telling me "rules is rules" after Darryl got burned Sept 6... Other people saw the #10 have contact so I'm not blind, but it's pretty clear to me what's happening here. A lot of favoritism...
Yes, I will admit, I did go down to victory lane when the #10 one. But in that incident, yes there was contact but it wasn't the #10 and the #98x. #10 was behind it, drove through the grass to avoid it and didn't hit anybody. The true driver who caused the #98x to spin was the #79 of Nicole Podewils. Now, I'm a big fan of Nicole (bigger fan of her then Doug for that matter), yet she was the one who hit the #98x and had it been my call, it should've been her and the #98x to the back, not the #10 jmo
-
Sunset= Worst officiating in the province........ Been that way since 2003 ;D
-
The same thing happened to us on the 6th Tex, we get dumped and had to go to the back. I dont like it, but thats the way it is
And Dave maybe your lowly Redskins might be able to squeek out a win this weekend ;D
-
Even I took St.Louis with the 10 points SCOTT..LOL Talk about a battle of the cap gun offences, betting the under sure looks good in that game too..
-
As for the starting crew at Sunset!! Is there anyone out there who can "do better.Maybe some people that their daddy use to flag there might remember that daddy made mistakes too. Even when he left and went elsewhere, he was not" MR PERFECT". Even as late as the last time I chatted with him, he said that it was never an easy job. People can make mistakes. Sunset is getting better and bigger in 2010. We even hear that with all the problems at other tracks how come there are a large number of drivers that are leaving to come to Sunset to race if they are so bad a starting crew?????????????????????
It is the best it has been since Steve and Carol use to run the track. The Slaughter family did a great job at keeping good car counts and fan count. I would like to say to Steve, carol Slaughter, Mark Dilley , Linda and the people behind the scenes putting the money into the track,a big "Thank You" from the bottom of our hearts for heading in the right direction and the many improvements that have been done and what is about to come over the next years to come. From the RACE FANS.
-
I think that you will find that Dave's comment was a little "tongue in cheek". Don't worry, one day we'll have him turn from his evil ways and come back to Sunset ;D ;D ;D
-
I think that you will find that Dave's comment was a little "tongue in cheek". Don't worry, one day we'll have him turn from his evil ways and come back to Sunset ;D ;D ;D
Oh he'll be there when Barrie is closed LOL... He might be dressed in a gorilla suit or some kind of disguise...
-
Dilley inherited the starters but I think they will be gone as pay back for nearly losing Sunset the franchise player Walters last year.
-
Dilley inherited the starters but I think they will be gone as pay back for nearly losing Sunset the franchise player Walters last year.
[/quote Another championship.What can you say about Walters.When the chips are down dont ever bet against him.He gets the job done, night after night,year after year. Whats this now 26 diferent championships and counting.Anyone know what his plans are for next year.
-
Morrow was a paper champion for the last two years last yr he wasn't even embarrased that he had the title handed to him, then the year before Walters ran half a season so he had no competiton. Octoberfest in Flamboro M.I.A. Fall Colors hiding in the Grandstands Mr Excitement gimme a break.
-
Morrow was a paper champion for the last two years last yr he wasn't even embarrased that he had the title handed to him, then the year before Walters ran half a season so he had no competiton. Octoberfest in Flamboro M.I.A. Fall Colors hiding in the Grandstands Mr Excitement gimme a break.
I agree with that, however you have to remember that Walters was the same "paper champion" at Barrie four years ago when he was handed the championship when John Gaunt missed a night.
-
I disagree you are missing the point, Walters had some competition that year unlike Morrow,to be honest I think Tim Watson should have won that year, and what about the year before when Walters kicked Gaunts @$$ at Barrie, Flamboro Octoberfest and in the Lucas Cup. Only Barrie fans talk about Gaunt but seriously "what has he won in the last 25 years" compared to Walters.
-
Ive gotta agree with that one,what has Gaunt won recently. Has there been any other driver win as many different big time races such as the Lucas cup,Alstar Super Series,Autumn colors,Octoberfest or even multiple track championships in one year as Walters in the last ,lets say 10 years. This guy has got to be by far the best or at least most successfull late model driver that i can recall in recent memory.
-
Ive gotta agree with that one,what has Gaunt won recently. Has there been any other driver win as many different big time races such as the Lucas cup,Alstar Super Series,Autumn colors,Octoberfest or even multiple track championships in one year as Walters in the last ,lets say 10 years. This guy has got to be by far the best or at least most successfull late model driver that i can recall in recent memory.
It's true Like it or not, and most don't like it. Walters is the best and for sure the most successful local short track racer I have seen in the last 20 years. It's true it's true.
-
Lots of other people have come out of Barrie other than Gaunt...
Maybe everybody forgets about Glenn Watson, Brandon Watson, Gaunt and also Mark Dilley... Yeah Walters is good, and probably the most successful but it's not like Barrie hasn't produced some superstars too. I'm not even getting into current drivers like Baker, Mc Leod and Sheppard...
-
Just saying that once you get past the Barrie Speedway Gaunt nut huggers you are right the most successful drivers to come out of Barrie in the last 10 years are Walters and Glen Watson and Give Baker kudos for being a real racer he is a past champion and shows up to race anytime anywhere, same with Shepherd past T/C champ who always shows up to race at invitationals etc. I believe that Barrie has better drivers than Sunset at present Barrie's top 5 drivers are really strong in all 3 divisions whether it will stay that way next year remains to be seen.
-
Barrie has better drivers than Sunset??? Okay, maybe in some respects some of the drivers are better BUT Sunset does have a good crop of its own.
Late Model: We have Tom Walters (the whom you rave about), Chris Morrow, Jason Witty, Rob Poole......they kept the racing tight all year, with others, such as Dario Capirchio. Tom's stats have already been discussed but lets not forget that Chris has 7 championships and Jason is doing really good, contending with these experienced vetrans with the fact he's in his third year. Heck, he almost won Autumn Colors last year.
Thunder Car: We've got Herb Walters, proven to be awesome, and Frank Davey, Barrie's 2008 champion. So how is it that the better crop is there when we've got the Barrie champ that beat them all? ??? Plus you can add Mark Adams and others to this list.
Mini Stock: Doug Butler, Warren Paxton, Paul Geniole Jr. (whose a rookie :O) and others that have kept the racing tight every weekend and Doug is proven to be one of the best by the dominance shown.
-
Barrie has the #6 thunder car,i beleive his name is THUNDER 6,now thats a rocket ship!!!lmfao
-
Barrie has better drivers than Sunset??? Okay, maybe in some respects some of the drivers are better BUT Sunset does have a good crop of its own.
Late Model: We have Tom Walters (the whom you rave about), Chris Morrow, Jason Witty, Rob Poole......they kept the racing tight all year, with others, such as Dario Capirchio. Tom's stats have already been discussed but lets not forget that Chris has 7 championships and Jason is doing really good, contending with these experienced vetrans with the fact he's in his third year. Heck, he almost won Autumn Colors last year.
Thunder Car: We've got Herb Walters, proven to be awesome, and Frank Davey, Barrie's 2008 champion. So how is it that the better crop is there when we've got the Barrie champ that beat them all? ??? Plus you can add Mark Adams and others to this list.
Mini Stock: Doug Butler, Warren Paxton, Paul Geniole Jr. (whose a rookie :O) and others that have kept the racing tight every weekend and Doug is proven to be one of the best by the dominance shown.
Take away Walters and Frank Davies Sunset has very little to offer, Morrow has 7 paper championships coz he had zero competition and please do not make me laugh by mentioning past champ Quesnelle who can't get out of his own way at Barrie.Sunset will be a whole new ball game with hopefully Doucette Beleskey, just need some llm and 4cyl competition.
-
Just saying that once you get past the Barrie Speedway Gaunt nut huggers you are right the most successful drivers to come out of Barrie in the last 10 years are Walters and Glen Watson and Give Baker kudos for being a real racer he is a past champion and shows up to race anytime anywhere, same with Shepherd past T/C champ who always shows up to race at invitationals etc. I believe that Barrie has better drivers than Sunset at present Barrie's top 5 drivers are really strong in all 3 divisions whether it will stay that way next year remains to be seen.
hell iam just glad some one noticed ther was more than 1 div at barrie, thanks allen
-
So I guess Adams, Herbie, Maltese, Britt, Walt, Smith, Holden and Murray are dogs? Take away Doucette and St.Onge and what does BSW really have? I would say the playing field is about the same. JMO
-
Barrie has the #6 thunder car,i beleive his name is THUNDER 6,now thats a rocket ship!!!lmfao
not any more, and that car is just as fast now as it always was. Wait for the new one.
-
When the invitationals hit Sunset the cream rises to the top and it comes from the Barrie dairy. The only guy we can count on to save our pride is the Stomper.
-
Barrie has the #6 thunder car,i beleive his name is THUNDER 6,now thats a rocket ship!!!lmfao
not any more, and that car is just as fast now as it always was. Wait for the new one.
So,ur buying the 00 car??
-
Larue, rumour has it another current thunder car driver will be purchasing that car...
-
Larry should buy that car because then he could win and go through the tech shed.
Up until now the routine has been win and get it on the trailer before anyone notices LOL :)
-
Larry should buy that car because then he could win and go through the tech shed.
Up until now the routine has been win and get it on the trailer before anyone notices LOL :)
all i got to say is 1.6 rockers are better then 1.5 roller rockers ;D ;D ;D
-
Haha you're funny Larry :) I'll give ya that :) when are you bringing that weapon of yours out again? Gonna have another crack at Autumn Colors?
-
Haha you're funny Larry :) I'll give ya that :) when are you bringing that weapon of yours out again? Gonna have another crack at Autumn Colors?
I will be at Autumn colors in a car.Its being prepared right now.Installing a very safe fuel cell and caging around it.If its done in time,which it should,will be at Sunset next week end,to beat up on chuckles!!lol
-
Good! We've missed your exciting personality, well not really, you've still been hanging around the pits, bugging us :) I wish you better luck than last year at A/C :)
-
next year at sunset will show who is what! who will figure out the track first? lots of great drivers at both tracks. as for morrow, he's just as much a champion as walters. i can remember chris killing everyone at ac a few years in a row. when chris is 50 and still racing, then we'll count the championships!
-
next year at sunset will show who is what! who will figure out the track first? lots of great drivers at both tracks. as for morrow, he's just as much a champion as walters. i can remember chris killing everyone at ac a few years in a row. when chris is 50 and still racing, then we'll count the championships!
Naah don't waste your time counting.Walters glory years were in the A division real late models he beat them all, now he is in the B division llm along side Morrow who's triumphs were only in the challenger and llm. Morrow tried to go up to the late models but realized his place. Fact is unlike Walters who has won consistantly at ( Barrie,Peterborough.Kawartha,Sunset,Flamboro.) Morrow has not won one race anywhere but Sunset in the last 5 plus years.
-
Alan, you're beginning to sound a little jilted. Why don't you buy Stompin Tom's car (it's for sale you know) and show us how you stack up to Chris? Otherwise, all your yapping is just on paper...right? I figure you'd come up short. You're busy hating on Morrow online, but I'm betting you stop by his trailer wearing your "Stompin Tom" shirt after the race to shake his hand and have a chat. Seems to be a small group of very vocal 'internet' Walters fans that thrive on bashing other drivers in the class. You don't see Tom or Chris posting trash on here, attempting to rain on the others parade. You make me laugh 'Alan', keep it up!
-
Alan, you're beginning to sound a little jilted. Why don't you buy Stompin Tom's car (it's for sale you know) and show us how you stack up to Chris? Otherwise, all your yapping is just on paper...right? I figure you'd come up short. You're busy hating on Morrow online, but I'm betting you stop by his trailer wearing your "Stompin Tom" shirt after the race to shake his hand and have a chat. Seems to be a small group of very vocal 'internet' Walters fans that thrive on bashing other drivers in the class. You don't see Tom or Chris posting trash on here, attempting to rain on the others parade. You make me laugh 'Alan', keep it up!
Glad you laughed it's good to laugh. I feel ashamed because you are right, I did stop by his trailer to shake his hand wearing my Walters shirt and hat but they told me to "hit the road" and never come back unless I had a two four of cold ones. W.T.F
-
OMG Larry! Too funny Man!
-
next year at sunset will show who is what! who will figure out the track first? lots of great drivers at both tracks. as for morrow, he's just as much a champion as walters. i can remember chris killing everyone at ac a few years in a row. when chris is 50 and still racing, then we'll count the championships!
Naah don't waste your time counting.Walters glory years were in the A division real late models he beat them all, now he is in the B division llm along side Morrow who's triumphs were only in the challenger and llm. Morrow tried to go up to the late models but realized his place. Fact is unlike Walters who has won consistantly at ( Barrie,Peterborough.Kawartha,Sunset,Flamboro.) Morrow has not won one race anywhere but Sunset in the last 5 plus years.
I remember Chris winning a alstar race at Sunset,with all the heavy hitters there,and the series didnt have to get their own officals after it!!!!lmao sorry Tommy
-
Well you say Morrow won an ALSTAR race at Sunset Larry??? I wish youd give me some of what you were smokin today then.. Morrow's one and only ALSTAR win came at Peterborough in 2005 I'm sorry to say.. And I'm not bashing Chris in any means by saying this as I know he's a talented wheel man and an equally class act.. But thats a fact jack!! It was Peterborough that saw his only ALSTAR win.. But if you doubt me we can bet a 24 of those coors light tall boys you said were on sale if you wish??LOL
-
Well you say Morrow won an ALSTAR race at Sunset Larry??? I wish youd give me some of what you were smokin today then.. Morrow's one and only ALSTAR win came at Peterborough in 2005 I'm sorry to say.. And I'm not bashing Chris in any means by saying this as I know he's a talented wheel man and an eqally class act.. But thats a fact jack!! It was Peterborough that saw his only ALSTAR win.. But if you doubt me we can bet a 24 of those coors light tall boys you said were on sale if you wish??LOL
Are you sure about that??The stuff i was smoking today was suppose to be some bad ass weed from Molson park,but turned out to be parsley...lol Well the tall boys are cheaper then the short boys lol
-
100 percent sure buds.. To be honest I think Morrow's most impressive performance in the ALSTAR series came in his first ever race at Sauble in 2004, when he qualified pole and led the first 50-60 laps till taken out by Robbie Thompson in a race that was eventually won by Tyler Williams.. Ironically enough, Morrow had a much better initial season in ALSTAR (2004) then his sophmore campaign when he won in 2005 at Pete. I know he also had a 2nd at Barrie (to Derrick Tiemersma) in 2004 as well..Molson Park you say?? Gee I guess I'm lucky that's just a stones throw from home then.... I love my parsley!!LOL