FWD 6cyl Street Stocks?

[AcroNym]

This would actually be fun to try, especially with a lot of FWD V6 cars also having EFI, ABS, Traction Control, and so on. Strip one of these down to a lightweight and they will compete with V8 RWD Street Stocks any time. Best of all, they are cheap and plentiful.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99059#msg99059

[ministock19]

So you are saying that a track should blindly follow other tracks  in order to ensure the sport will prosper, at the expense of ignoring the problems/solutions in their own back yard. Ya, that will sure work . Varney tried working with other tracks and what happened? The deep pockets in Innisfil basically screwed them over.

Varney is in a very different area than most tracks,with no large population center to draw from, a very low dollar blue collar area. There is a very loyal,good sized fan base and a decent core group of racers. At present, Varney needs to do what is best for Varney, period. If that means 6 cyl fwd then so be it.

Personally, I would love to see province wide common rules. However even if that happened there could still be viable niche classes at any and every track.
 

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99061#msg99061

[AcroNym]

If you are going to count all those asphalt tracks, you would need to count all the dirt tracks within the same distance. Cornwall, Brockville, Brighton, Merrittville, Oshweken, Humberstone all get well over 100 cars in the pits every week. Then if you go a short drive over the border there are lots more dirt tracks to race on with very good car counts.

Racers have never changed. They always want more and more. Leave the rules up to the racers and in no time a street stock will be a super late model. The cycle happens over and over.

The best tracks I have seen with solid car counts are those tracks that do not let the racers vote on the rules packages. The track has the rules or uses a sanctioning bodies rule set.

Every racer has his/her own agenda and ideas of what they think is best. This just causes the situation that the asphalt tracks are facing now.

For example, a basic Street Stock Class. Every track has them. The drivers at track “A” vote to allow racing tires on the premise that they can buy “used” tires from the (insert higher class here) thus reducing tire costs and everybody will save money. But because the tires have so much more traction axles, ball joints, and control arms are bending and breaking. So for safety reasons they vote to allow 9” rears, aftermarket control arms, etc. Now these cars are not on parity with any other Street Stock classes in the area.
 
Meanwhile, at track “B” the racers have voted to allow cams and headers because OEM cams and manifolds are not any good and too expensive. Aftermarket parts are much cheaper.
Whatever the reasons are, every different racer has his or her own agenda and his or her own justification.

Sometimes the promoters make their tracks rules different to discourage their racers from traveling. If a racer from track A wrecks at track B, the car may not be fixed on time for track A’s next race.

There was a time in Ontario that you could run 1 car almost anywhere. Then even into the 80’s when the promoters started with protectionism, there were still 70 to 80 cars show up to qualify for a 24 car feature at the Beach, Varney, Barrie, etc. I haven’t seen that at any asphalt tracks in Ontario since 86 or so, but the dirt tracks still get some pretty big car counts.

Some people will say that there are lots of cars sitting around in back fields, barns, etc., but where can they meet the rules without a major rebuild? Maybe that is why they are sitting around, cheaper/easier to build new? Can’t sell because there is no market?
If you would look at a DIRTcar Modified or Sportsman, you could race that car anywhere from the NE including Ontario and Quebec, down to Florida. Do you have a used car you want to sell? There is a big market. IMCA Modifieds are raced all over the USA and western provinces.  This is another big market.

It just doesn’t make sense to build a car for say….. Delaware, when the only place it can be raced is at Delaware, or possibly some invitational races. When I want to stop racing, the only market I have to sell the car is a handful of people around Delaware.


Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99072#msg99072

[Wheelsspin]

I'm wondering how many didn't quit racing but just moved on to some of the touring series (oss, cvm, can am midgets, etc ...) so they didn't have to put up with home track politics?

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99078#msg99078

[lre36]

ALL tracks need a strong beginners class This is where new racers get a start and new fans come to watch family or friends. Cars for this kind of racing need to be easy to find and cheap to fix. The parts have to be part store or wrecking yard NO RACE PARTS AT ALL. Very basic rules and safety equipment. Then you dedicate 2 or 3 people to make sure the cars are solid the safety items are used properly. You keep them on minimum b wear rated tire with absolutely no high performance stock or after market parts. The easiest way to do this is to run hockey mom front wheel drive retired rides. Everybody has one and they are cheap compared to all the choices. These are the new street stocks. They are what street stocks have always been. Cars that people know and understand.

Varney has always had the most success by being a local racer local fan style of track. JP at Peterborough works alot the same way. That is why it is fun to visit over there.

We have spent the last ten years or so with racers telling the tracks what the rules should be. It has not worked. It drove away some really dedicated racers and scared away people who really wanted to try it. Run with the big dogs or stay on the porch. They made their choice. Local tracks dont need big time racing. It has been strange watching track after track try be the center of the racing world (spending money) then have to sell to keep from loosing everything. The sad thing is it hurts the racers that spent that much trying to keep up.

The dirt versus pavement thing is simple. The builders make the rules in the upper classes of dirt car racing. This makes road shows easier to put on. But the local tracks adjust rules as needed. Pavement tracks tend to work with a local builder. They will sell what ever they can make the most money on. The strange thing is when you talk to them they cant believe how out of hand the cost of racing is. Racers are funny bunch. They keep spending until they are broke. Then complain that promotors need to pay better. The seem to forget that either fans or the racers themselves have to put up more money. To a promotor fans are the most important thing. Racers tend to forget the fans pay the bills. If it cost to much to bring your family to the track you wont go. This means the racer will pay for a higher pay out. The idea that sponsors pay for it all has never worked at any level. Sponsers have been cleaned out and really are struggling like everbody else.

Varneys joke classes bring fans. If we have fans we all have place to race. Local rules and classes will work here or at any track. Let a racer find a track and class that he or she can afford they will be there every week. Bring in the travelling shows (they have one set of rules sort of) see if the fans like it. The big thing is there is to be careful with your gate costs. Fans are getting harder fool. They go to a track wanting their moneys worth. Paying for somebodys 40 thousand dollar race car is not everybodys idea of fun.

Varney has a great fan base. I have had  people talk to me about races or cars that i or other drivers have driven over the years and i dont mean 1 or 2. They supported the track as much or more as any race team there.  If the fans want train races and demolition king of the hill then lets help it happen.

Yes some classes are trouble but not just at Varney. Rear wheel drive v8 as a so called stock class is done. The only way to have that would be trucks. Now that somebody has actualy said it can we let go of the past and start to work on the present. Trucks will work. There enough upset thunder (late model lites) teams to create a class that is the only real choice there is. Talk to one another if you are willing to give it try. If you put together 12 or 14 teams with rules that are affordable and simple and stock you might be suprised how welcome you will be.


One last thought. Buying a used race car is like buying a used hockey stick.You know how it has been used and you never pay new price. But if it is a good enough piece it might make you into a hero before it breaks

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99086#msg99086

[varneyspeedway]

Wow!

Didn't think this would get so heated. Mind you...a little off-topic at times but, heated none the less.

So, if I'm reading these posts correctly...and I want to stay away from the topics about "how to run a track"...it sounds like the consensus is that:

...and again, not my opinions but, my interpretations of the posts here...

Varney should:

-forget incorporating 6cyl into the current Street Stocks but rather, create a new class of 6cyl Street Stocks?
-either encourage Trucks into the current Street Stocks and keep the class or; get rid of the current Street Stock Class and instead, adopt another track's Thunder rules and bring that class back?

No one seems concerned about the Late Models at Varney and nor should they be. I think we have a good model there that will grow. Varney is the only track where you can show up with a $10 000 Late Model and win.....assuming you don't have to beat the odd visiting guy with the $50 000 Late Models that sometimes show up.

Stock 4's should be left alone? The whole 16v thing still rears it's ugly head.


Modifeds stay on a limited schedule although, I personally missed them this past season and would like to see a few more nights.

Fringe series such as Trains, King of The Hill, Womens Challenge all keep butts in the stands so, why get rid of them? The fans are happy with them.

Did I miss anything?


.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99090#msg99090

[latemodel28]

^^^^ Yea Ontario's new Short track format: Lawnmowers, 4-funs, v6 trucks and headlining the night mini stocks.....that will draw the fans out! 

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99093#msg99093

[tractorfix]

Yetti what derbying are you talking about. LOL! I did it for 20 years and switched to stock cars cause it was cheaper! Yah the 4-banger derbys are pretty basic(but beginning to go coocoo) but V-8's, forget about it. Southern cars, $5000 motors new trannys,rads,12 bolts with full spools, gears, totally cheated 3 ways to Sunday. it gets crazier the more $ is at stake. Its no different than any other motorsport Winning derbys takes experience, ambition, skill, knowledge and LOTS of $. Why do they get 50 cars to a derby? Cause the inviatationals can pay up to 10grand to win and even the local fair ones pay 600-1500 to win. But they usually only pay back to 3rd. And if you follow them around you'll find a core of guys that run them all and 3 of them do 95% of the winning with BIG BUCK cars. Sound Familiar?

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99095#msg99095

[crazyhorse]

^^^^ Yea Ontario's new Short track format: Lawnmowers, 4-funs, v6 trucks and headlining the night mini stocks.....that will draw the fans out! 

HAHAHA im with him 100% think about what your tryin to tell varney to do? run nothing but junk classes,so every turns there heads!! wake up no one gives a shit about this stuff but varney,no wonder your car count sucks balls!!


Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99097#msg99097

[crazyhorse]

 A field of junk cars 3 wide the whole race is 1 million times better than the most expensive cars and no passing.


say what you want,do you race at varney? have you seen how poor the car count is???
ya single file racing is boring,at leat they have cars to form a line!
sure bring in the junk stock or what ever your willin to call it,give it a year,an i bet 5 of your junk stock drivers have there STOCK AN CHEAP  cars CHEATED  up so bad it isnt funny, its a monkey see monkey do track,there goes your cheap racin again
leave it well enough alone
if some one wants to try racing,go buy a junk yard car an try king of the hill,,,the guy who comes up with the ideas on here,he sits in a god damn booth at varney an tells you who won the race,he has no fuckin clue what goes on in the pits,what racers want or need or dont need, what rules need to be inforced an stick to there guns!

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99105#msg99105

[varneyspeedway]

the guy who comes up with the ideas on here,he sits in a god damn booth at varney an tells you who won the race,he has no fuckin clue what goes on in the pits,what racers want or need or dont need, what rules need to be inforced an stick to there guns!

You sir...are a jack ass. You think because I spend my night in the booth calling the races that I don't know what's going on in the pits? You couldn't be more wrong. I may be the announcer but, I have been there for 6 years and think I have a pretty good idea what's going on in the pits. To insult me because I am just the "announcer" shows what an ignorant tool you are and, who has nothing better to do than to use his 15th post on this board to stir shit up for no reason.
You think the ideas I'm suggesting on here are mine alone? These are ideas and conversations I have with drivers every Saturday night as I spend upwards of 2 hours after each race night talking to drivers and assissting in 'problem solving' at the track. Threads like this are the result of what I am hearing in the pits you idiot....not me just passing time. So, while I may not be a mechanic or involved with tech, I do have a pretty good idea about what's going on in the pits.

I will agree with one thing you said....no one wants to sit and watch junk classes all night and that is not what we as a track are suggesting.


You are obviously a disgruntled driver who, for whatever reason, can't run up front and therefore has to bash any kind of foreward thinking to justify your poor performance or...you are one of these guys who wishes they could be out there running for the checkers but, for whatever reason, sits in the stands and bitches about how shitty a job everyone does at everything they do.;

We're trying to move foreward and you would rather sit back on the porch in your rocking chair chewing tobacco and spitting about the gool ole days.

If you don't like our product, stay on your porch or keep it on the trailer. If you don't have anything relative to contribute to this thread, keep your mouth shut and go back to to your track of choice that seems to apparently do no wrong.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99110#msg99110

[ministock19]

^^^ Gold, solid gold ^^^ 

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99111#msg99111

[crazyhorse]

the guy who comes up with the ideas on here,he sits in a god damn booth at varney an tells you who won the race,he has no fuckin clue what goes on in the pits,what racers want or need or dont need, what rules need to be inforced an stick to there guns!

You sir...are a jack ass. You think because I spend my night in the booth calling the races that I don't know what's going on in the pits? You couldn't be more wrong. I may be the announcer but, I have been there for 6 years and think I have a pretty good idea what's going on in the pits. To insult me because I am just the "announcer" shows what an ignorant tool you are and, who has nothing better to do than to use his 15th post on this board to stir shit up for no reason.
You think the ideas I'm suggesting on here are mine alone? These are ideas and conversations I have with drivers every Saturday night as I spend upwards of 2 hours after each race night talking to drivers and assissting in 'problem solving' at the track. Threads like this are the result of what I am hearing in the pits you idiot....not me just passing time. So, while I may not be a mechanic or involved with tech, I do have a pretty good idea about what's going on in the pits.

I will agree with one thing you said....no one wants to sit and watch junk classes all night and that is not what we as a track are suggesting.


You are obviously a disgruntled driver who, for whatever reason, can't run up front and therefore has to bash any kind of foreward thinking to justify your poor performance or...you are one of these guys who wishes they could be out there running for the checkers but, for whatever reason, sits in the stands and bitches about how shitty a job everyone does at everything they do.;

We're trying to move foreward and you would rather sit back on the porch in your rocking chair chewing tobacco and spitting about the gool ole days.

If you don't like our product, stay on your porch or keep it on the trailer. If you don't have anything relative to contribute to this thread, keep your mouth shut and go back to to your track of choice that seems to apparently do no wrong.

matter of fact jody when i did run there i was out front ALL THE TIME,an no you dont walk around for 2 hours a night tryin to fix problems,maybe spend 2 hours a night tryin to pull your head out of your ass! the only people you talk to is your LITTLE GETALONG GANG the ones that only want to fix there class! so stop talkin bull shit you fuckin goof

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99112#msg99112

[varneyspeedway]

Thank you very much for showing us all how valid your opinions are and how we should all run to your pit stall to listen to you preach about how the world of stock car racing can be fixed if we just follow you and your wisdom.

For the record, I didn't say I spend 2 hours a night "fixing problems", I said I assist in problem solving. There are way more people at Varney than just myself who actually give a shit about the place unlike you.

I don't know who you are and don't really give a shit either. As far as my "get along gang"....I chose to spend my time with people who have more to say than just name calling behind some online alias and raising shit where it doesn't need to be raised.

Again, you come across as a bitter, jaded racer who probably didn't get a rule changed in their favour and decided to just bash whoever they could for whatever they could.

Why is it every time you p[ost on CRO, it is just to stir shit and bash people and call them names.

Go work on your car get back on the track if you're so fast.

Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99113#msg99113

[crazyhorse]

doug may as well give up,he clearly has mno idea what the hell he is talkin about


Linkback: https://www.canadianracingonline.com/smf/index.php?topic=14489.msg99119#msg99119